Orchard People

Welcome to the Urban Forestry Radio Show, brought to you by the Community Orchard Network. In this monthly podcast, I'm going to take you on a journey. We'll learn about fruit trees, permaculture, food forests, and so much more. So if you're a gardener and enjoy growing your own food, if you love trees and especially fruit trees, or if you're just interested in living a more sustainable life, you've come to the right place.
I'm Susan Poizner, your host for today. So get ready, roll up your sleeves, and let's dig in to today's episode.
Welcome to the Urban Forestry Radio Show with your host Susan Poizner, right here on Reality Radio 101. To contact Susan live, email her, realityradio101@yahoo.com.
And now your host of the Urban Forestry Radio Show. Susan Poizner. Welcome to the show today.
[00:01:54] The Role of Fruit Trees in Alleviating World Hunger
So how can fruit trees help alleviate world hunger? It sounds pretty obvious. You just plant more fruit trees and harvest them and then people have more to eat, right? Well, if only growing fruit trees was that easy.
Anyone who has worked with fruit trees knows that in order to thrive, they need hands on care. Pruning, fertilizing, pest and disease prevention, and more. Luckily, there's a growing interest in fruit trees around the world, and new orchardists are keen to learn how to care for these trees so that they'll not only produce well today, but they'll be able to feed our families and communities for years to come.
And yet fruit trees and other types of perennial crops can play even more of a role in tackling poverty and ending world hunger, as I discovered in learning about a project by the Arbor Day Foundation.
[00:02:53] Arbor Day Foundation's Coffee Project
The Arbor Day Foundation is working with coffee producers in Peru and nine other countries around the world.
To produce shade grown coffee. This project helps to protect precious rainforests and it also ensures that these growers are well paid for their work. I'm going to talk to Ryan hat of the Arbor Day Foundation about that in the first part of today's show, in the second part of the program. We're going to chat about nut trees and the role that they can play in keeping us well fed in the future.
My second guest will be Ernie Grimo of Grimo Nut Nursery here in Ontario. But first, let's start with a good cup of coffee and a good chat with Ryan Hatt of the Arbor Day Foundation. Ryan is on the line with me now and he's in Lincoln, Nebraska. How are you today, Ryan? Hi, I'm doing well. How are you? I'm very well.
Thank you so much. It's great to have you on the show. I'm really curious about this whole project with coffee. Let's start with the basics. How is coffee grown? Well, coffee is grown in tropical areas. really all over the world, but in areas that are close to the equator, between the Tropic of Cancer and the Tropic of Capricorn.
Most coffee is grown at elevation as well, but coffee naturally is a plant that has grown within the shade of the rainforest. That's where it initially started, and that's where it thrives best, is under the canopy of the rainforest. So is it a shrub? Is it a small tree? So the coffee, the coffee tree is actually a shrub, with a very short root system.
And they'll grow to be eight, you know, eight to ten to twelve feet tall or so. and they'll produce fruit, the coffee cherries, for about ten to twelve years. How long does it take until you actually get a decent harvest from these shrubs? It'll take about three years of a new crop being planted before it really starts producing the coffee cherries.
It's funny because ten to twelve years doesn't really sound that long when you think about apple trees can grow for a hundred years or more. yeah, that's, that's very true. It's a crop where they're constantly having to, you know, they're constantly planting new shrubs every year. one is to maintain the diversity of their crop, to plant some different varieties, so that maybe there'll be some that'll be less susceptible to different diseases or maybe, infestations out there.
but also just to ensure that they have that crop for upcoming years, so that their entire crop doesn't I'll die out at once. They'll almost have different ages of coffee shrubs that are out there so that they'll have some sort of a harvest coming in every year.
[00:05:57] Challenges Faced by Coffee Growers
So so what are the main challenges for coffee growers in these countries?
Well, you know, sun grown coffee has really been a problem within the industry for about the last 40 years or so. back in the 70s, farmers were paid really on a per pound basis for their coffee, regardless of the quality of the coffee. And so that forced them to start looking for ways to try and increase their productivity.
in order to do that, they found that if they cut the trees down and grew coffee in the sun, that would actually increase their productivity. It would be cheaper labor. they could mechanize the process a little bit more. but that, the, the end result of all of that is that the quality of the coffee then started to go down.
And, of course, we started to lose lots of rainforest. So, now it's an educational challenge of Talking to these farmers and showing them that really the sustainable way to grow coffee is under the canopy of the rain forest and That, in itself, is going to produce a higher quality coffee, since that's the natural place where coffee is supposed to be grown.
And because of the higher quality, hopefully they can receive a higher price per pound to justify their additional efforts in growing it in a responsible way. What I find truly amazing is most plants, if it's a full sun plant and you put it in the shade, it does not thrive. And so you would think that if it is a shade plant, the coffee tree, if it's supposed to thrive in the shade, how does it do in a full sun situation?
I'm surprised that they can continue growing like that.
It's grown in regions where they'll have a very rainy season in the in the off season, and too much rain can actually affect the overall harvest of the coffee. If it has too much rain, the yield of their crop will go down. So the benefit of growing coffee really in the sun is that it is able to dry out the coffee shrubs and therefore it can produce a lot more fruit and it'll actually grow a lot faster as well so they can harvest a little bit earlier in the year.
[00:08:11] Sustainable Coffee Farming Practices
So so what's the approach of your program? What in fact do you do with the Arbor Day Foundation? so we source all of our coffee that is, that is grown under the canopy of the rain forest, and then we package and distribute and sell our coffee branded as Arbor Day Coffee, in a number of different industries.
We sell at retail, online, we're in a number of different hotels. Out there, and we're starting to gain a lot of popularity on college and university campuses, but our main focus really is finding that coffee that is out there and working with those co ops to ensure that they're growing coffee in a responsible and sustainable way.
Which, in turn, gives us a high quality coffee that we pay the farmers a fair wage for. We ensure that we pay them that fair wage, again, to justify their additional efforts in that. We ensure, then, that the farmers have access to health care, education, and work on projects that will build up and improve their overall infrastructure.
It may be Clean drinking water, or electricity access, or maybe even just new roads. Are you working with partners? Or is this just your organization? we have many, supporters of our program, that are, that are, purchasing and, brewing and serving our coffee at their many locations, and they have been great supporters.
one of those great supporters is Wyndham Worldwide. we're in over 200 of their different resorts, across the country, and they serve Arbor Day coffee in their rooms. And in their lobbies as well, and has saved millions of square feet of rain forest by serving Arbor Day coffee at those locations.
[00:10:04] Impact of Arbor Day Foundation's Coffee Program
So Ryan, you have traveled to some of these countries. What is it like for you to see how these trees, how these plants are grown and how the people interact with them? The whole experience is just a life changing experience, coming from a place in the United States where we're well developed and going to a third world country, where they are really just living on practically nothing to get by, is very eye opening.
I've had experiences like this travel in the past, but the coffee industry is just very unique in that, You know, these coffee farmers have had or have worked in this industry all of their lives, and it's the only trade that they know. And in the many conversations that I have with these farmers, I hear time and time again, coffee is our life, and you bring us life.
Referring to Arbor Day Foundation and what we're doing with our program. And so they absolutely depend on coffee for everything. For feeding their families, for clothing their families, for building their communities. just to give you an example, the average Peruvian earns less than 5, 000 a year. which is, you know, hard for us to even comprehend, in the United States.
so every little bit really helps. These farmers out. and while they live on so little, they're still so happy with their lives. they feel very blessed. they're proud of their work. They're proud of their harvest and the coffee that they produce and, you know, they, they love their families and would probably choose no other way to live their life.
So it's just absolutely incredible people. It sounds absolutely wonderful. It's interesting because, as you said, most coffee farmers, I would think, are, you know, clear cutting the land, cutting down the rainforest. So how do you find people who haven't done that yet? Are they beginners that you're working with?
Are they people who Have ClearCut in the past and have moved to new territory to spread out their growing, their coffee growing? Yeah, it's, it's a challenge sometimes to find shade grown coffee, especially in certain countries, such as Brazil. Brazil puts a lot of focus on just coffee production and will sometimes, it seems, will do any, take any means necessary to do that, even if it means destroying Large sections of the Amazon rain forest.
but we, we look for coffee in a number of different ways. You know, we definitely prefer for natural forest to be preserved. and if, if we can find situations like that and farms and co ops that have that natural forest. that's really going to produce the best coffee. And then we can provide that coffee here to our market in the United States.
But we work with a number of farmers to where maybe they're. Parents or their grandparents had deforested land, maybe used it to grow coffee in the sun, or maybe raised cattle for a while, and they're working on reforesting that area, and they see the importance that trees bring to maintaining soil quality to, holding the soil in place and protecting it and eliminating landslides and mudslides.
So they'll start to plant trees in infertile areas, and then that will enrich the ground. For Which, down the road, they can then plant coffee underneath. So we've seen situations, really, in reforestation, all the way to maintaining that natural forest as well. Hm. What are the main challenges that they face, in terms of pest and disease problems, or just problems with growing the plants?
Yeah, there are a number of different diseases and funguses and infestations that are out there right now. one of the biggest ones that, that coffee farmers are really facing is a fungus called Larroya, or it's also referred to as coffee rust. And it's basically a fungus that attacks the leaves of the coffee shrub.
And it'll eat away at the leaves and leave kind of a red looking rust colored fungus on the leaves. So the leaves eventually die off. The shrub will continue to produce fruit for the next year or so, but eventually the shrub dies off once those leaves are off the plant. And so they're then forced to Try and, you know, plant more, coffee shrubs in its place and then try and reinvigorate their farm.
And there's a lot of research out there on which varieties are, are more susceptible to it and less susceptible. And farmers are looking for That direction as far as what can they do going forward to prevent an entire loss of their crop due to this coffee rust? but that's just one example. There are coffee borer beetles that will bore into the seed and lay their larvae in the coffee seeds and, will cause, Does this seem to be a defect in the coffee?
there are all kinds of, diseases that will attack the roots of the coffee shrubs that will kill the plant as well. And overall, you hear a lot from the farmers that climate change is making a big difference. that the, the weather is getting warmer. And, It's not cooling off enough to allow the coffee cherries to really mature slowly and at a good rate so that it develops a high quality coffee.
So they're really seeing the effects of climate change take its toll on the coffee industry as well. Wow.
[00:16:04] Organic Practices and Pest Management
Will, do they use chemical pesticides and fungicides or is it organic growing? Well, with, with shade grown coffee, because the trees provide those natural nutrients into the soil and can enrich the soil, the farmers don't have to rely as much on the use of pesticides and fertilizers.
in cases where maybe they are getting attacked by some kind of an infestation, we always encourage them to use organic fertilizers, in that sense, so that they can save their crop. Because what it comes down to for the farmers, if they lose their entire crop, then they lose their entire livelihood.
They have no way of supporting their family. So we look for organic substitutes that we can use in place. during the harvest process, they'll actually depulp the coffee cherry. And the coffee bean itself is actually the seed inside the cherry. So they'll use that cherry pulp. and put it into a compost area, which they can then turn into an organic fertilizer.
They'll mix it with different, wood chips and other organic matter. And then they can actually use that as an organic fertilizer within their coffee farms. so a way to not just allow all that pulp to go to waste, but to reuse it in an organic way. Amazing. Ryan, we need to take a break for a few minutes for some words from our sponsors.
But after the break, I'd love to talk to you a little bit more. So can you hold on the line for a minute? Absolutely. Okay, wonderful. We'll speak to you again in a minute. You're listening to the Irvin Forestry Radio Show on Reality Radio 101. I'm Susan Poizner. And we'll be back soon after this short break.
[00:18:07] Community Orchard Network and Sponsor Messages
Are you new to growing fruit trees or perhaps a seasoned expert? Either way, come and join the Community Orchard Network. We are a group of community and home orchardists. From across North America who gather through monthly webinars, radio broadcasts like this one and podcasts, we want to share our experience, deepen our knowledge, and widen the movement.
Join the conversation. Visit www.orchardpeople.com/network to find out more. This message was brought to you by the Baltimore Orchard Project.
Hey Sally, your garden is looking great today. Thanks Gary. Your lawn is looking a little bit dry. Ah, that's okay. It's all going to change. Soon I'm going to plant a fruit tree in my yard. I'm thinking an apple tree or maybe peach. That sounds great, but do you know what you're doing? Well, fruit trees are easy.
You just plant them, water them, and wait for the harvest, right? Actually, that's not quite the case. What? Organic orchardists spend a lot of time protecting their fruit trees from pest and disease problems. Really? And in order to thrive, fruit trees need to be pruned every year. Hmm, I didn't know that.
I'll tell you what, before you buy your tree, why don't you go to orchardpeople. com. You'll learn lots about growing fruit from the blog, and there's a fantastic monthly newsletter with seasonal tips and reminders. Maybe I should check that out. Yeah, then if you really want to move ahead, You can sign up for OrchardPeople.
com's beginner fruit tree care course. So maybe I should hold off on buying my tree today. You got it. The more, you know, the better your tree will grow. Sign up for a free membership to OrchardPeople. com today.
Welcome back to the Urban Forestry Radio Show with your host, Susan Poizner, right here on Reality Radio 101. To contact Susan, send her an email. realityradio101@yahoo.com And now, right back to your host
This is the Urban Forestry Radio show brought to you by the Community Orchard Network. I'm Susan Poizner, and today I'm chatting with Ryan Hatt of the Arbor Day Foundation. We're talking about how the Arbor Day Foundation is using trees and shrubs. to help combat global hunger. So Ryan, we've been specifically talking about Arbor Day Foundation's coffee program.
Are there any lessons that you've learned from this project that can possibly be applied to other tree, or edible tree based projects? Yeah, absolutely. you know, coffee is really a, it's a community undertaking. What I found with these coffee communities that we visited, each farmer will have their section of land, but the community will all get together and help each other out during harvest time.
So they'll go to one farm, do the harvest, everybody moves on to the next, and they all work as one unit, working together, helping each other out. Each makes their money and their profit off of the, the, The yield that their farm individually produced, but it's amazing to see these, these farmers getting together and doing this.
so that's, that's one way of, of when people get together, they really can make a difference in the world and, and, and affect hunger and, and different situations that are out there. Absolutely. It's interesting. Myself as a community orchardist, I see how fruit trees bring people together, you know, and really help us to collaborate with each other.
I think trees themselves have so much wisdom. Somehow they guide us and they help us to work together. Definitely. Absolutely. Now, on the other hand, global hunger is a serious problem, all over the world. So do you really think trees and shrub can make a dent in this very big problem? Absolutely. trees are one of the factors that I think can definitely make a significant impact in helping the world solve itself of global issues like hunger and poverty.
In fact, at the Arbor Day Foundation, our vision is really being a leader in creating that worldwide recognition of using trees as a way to help solve global issues, such as poverty, hunger, Air and water pollution, deforestation, climate change, and dependency on natural resources. So, with the many programs that we have now, we try to see if that addresses those global issues.
And moving forward with new programs that we develop, and as we start to have even more of a global presence and more global impact all over the world, As an Arbor Day foundation, we really want to stress that our programs impact those areas and that people will see that trees definitely can play a role now, not the only solution by any means.
There are a lot of things that we need to do to make our world a better place, but trees are definitely a foundation. to having so many different impacts in areas. So does Arbor Day Foundation have any other interesting projects in the pipeline that involve, trees and poverty or hunger? Oh, I mean, we have programs, Everything from domestically, with our Tree City USA program, it's an urban forestry program that allows communities to develop their urban forest plan within their cities, with 3, 400 cities across the United States.
so we have that. It's been one of our longest and most successful programs in the, in the history of our organization. to we have global projects such as reforesting areas in Madagascar that are seeing declines in lemur population and by planting trees out there is providing jobs for some of those local, villagers and some of the local people out there providing income for them while also reforesting this habitat, that is helping to bring back different endangered species.
So a lot of things definitely in the pipeline, a lot of very exciting things that are going on with the Arbor Day Foundation. And we appreciate so much the support of our million members across the United States, and our many corporate partners across the country as well that are helping us in those efforts.
So how can people, our listeners, how can we help? How can we encourage people to buy the coffee or to get involved in your programs? Sure, I'd say, the first step would be to visit our website, arborday. org, and you can learn more about our coffee there, and you could even go to arborday. org slash coffee, to learn specifically more about our coffee.
But if you want to get involved with the Arbor Day Foundation, visit arborday. org and you can become a member of the Arbor Day Foundation and your donation will go toward replanting trees within a national forest, here in the United States, or you can even. Look to have your donation go toward a rainforest rescue.
If you have really your heart set on making a difference in the rainforest areas all around the world. So a number of different types of memberships and ways that you can contribute and really. Make a difference with the coffee program. We do sell our coffee on our website. And with every cup you drink, you yourself preserve two square feet of rain forest.
so it's something that you can enjoy and the comfort of your home, but know that you made a big difference that morning and what a great gift that would be of giving that to someone and allowing them to share in that special connection with the world as well. That's a beautiful idea and it's making me very thirsty for a good cup of coffee.
Thank you so much, Ryan, for coming on the show today, for chatting with me. I've learned a lot and I look forward to following more about this project and the other projects that you do there. Definitely. Well, thanks for having me, Susan. Love the opportunity to be able to tell this story about our coffee program in any way we can, so I appreciate you allowing me to share this story.
My pleasure. Okay, well, goodbye for now. We'll talk to you again. Okay, take care. So as a community orchardist here in Toronto, I have seen how fruit trees do a lot more than just produce fruit. And as I said earlier, they have a way of bringing communities together and helping people work together. So it sounds like coffee can do the same thing.
Now in a minute, we're coming up to a message from our sponsors.
[00:27:53] Nut Trees as a Solution to Global Hunger
But then after that, while fruit trees can be a little bit finicky and a little bit demanding, nut trees are supposed to be super easy to grow. Could they be a part of a strategy to tackle global hunger? We'll find out after the break, when I talk to Ernie Grimo of Grimo Nut Nursery.
You're listening to Reality Radio 101. This is the Urban Forestry Radio Show, brought to you by the Community Orchard Network. I'm Susan Poizner, and I'll be back after the break. Waiting on a cue to turn and run when all I needed was the truth. That's how it's gotta be.
This broadcast has been sponsored by Tree Campus USA, a program of the Arbor Day Foundation. Tree Campus USA honors college campuses and their leaders for promoting healthy urban forest management, and also for getting the community involved in environmental stewardship.
Last year, 254 colleges and universities in the United States were recognized with Tree Campus USA distinction. All of them had to meet five standards, including having a tree advisory committee, having a tree care plan in place, spending some of the campus budget on tree planting and education.
Organizing an Arbor Day celebration and engaging students in tree related projects and initiatives.
Are you interested in finding out how you can get involved? Visit www. arborday. org slash treecampususa Tree Campus USA is an Arbor Day Foundation program sponsored in partnership with Toyota.
Where am I? This place is amazing. There are birds, bees, and fruit trees, and I'm in the middle of a big city. You are in Philadelphia. Our city is growing more beautiful each year thanks to the Philadelphia Orchard Project. We plant fruit trees, berry bushes, and other edibles in city parks, gardens, and other public places.
I can see that. Raspberry canes, fig trees, and peaches. If I lived nearby, I would never go hungry. That's one of our goals. We want to help communities grow their own food by teaching residents how to plant fruit trees. We focus on the neighborhoods that need it most. It sounds like a great project. How can I help?
How can I learn more? Please visit our website at phillyorchards. org to volunteer or donate. And you can also follow our Urban Orchard blog. phillyorchards. org I will definitely check it out. Thanks so much and have a great day. This message was brought to you by the Philadelphia Orchard Project.
Welcome back to the Urban Forestry Radio Show with your host, Susan Poizner. Right here on Reality Radio 101. To contact Susan, email her Reality radio101@yahoo.com.
Hey, now right back to your host, Susan Poiser.
[00:32:10] Introduction and Recap
I'm Susan Poizner, and you're listening to the Urban Forestry Radio Show, brought to you by the Community Orchard Network, a program where we learn about fruit trees, food forests, permaculture, and lots more. Thanks for tuning in. In the first part of the show, we talked about how coffee plants can bring abundance to impoverished communities.
[00:32:31] Nut Trees: A Solution for North Korea
In this segment, we'll talk about nut trees and the role that they can play. I recently read an article about an initiative in North Korea where, for years, hillside forests were cut down in order to make room for farmland. The result was pretty devastating. These areas became toxic wastelands. There was soil erosion and seasonal flooding that damaged local rice paddies and contributed to a famine that killed many.
One of the ways the North Korean government is dealing with the problem is by increasingly planting fruit and nut trees on these once forested slopes. Hoping to bring back the tree cover while providing food for the local population.
[00:33:20] Interview with Ernie Grimo: Growing Nut Trees
So my second guest today is quite an expert in growing nut trees.
Ernie Grimo is the owner of Grimo Nut Nursery and he's on the line from Niagara on the Lake. How are you, Ernie? I'm fine, Susan. Is it a lovely day there? it is a nice day, yes. So Ernie, how long have you been growing nut trees for? Well, about 50 years, all told, but I've been at this location about, 44, 45 years.
How did you get involved in this? It was a hobby and, it, it just went wild. I, I started out in a city, house lot and pretty soon I had a hundred trees growing in the backyard and nowhere to go with them. So I decided to buy three acres out in the country and plant them there, and I didn't like the soil conditions, and, so I looked for a better soil location, and I ended up here in Niagara Lake.
Wow. So now how much space do you have, and how many trees are you growing out there? Well, I have, 14 acres altogether, 4 acres in nursery stock, and 10 acres in orchards. So, okay, we've been talking about the role that nut trees could possibly play in, in facing problems like global hunger. Can you see that?
Does that make sense to you? Oh, definitely. I've always believed in the edible landscape. I always like going out and foraging for, nuts in the fall and that's what really got me started in the first place. I wanted to be able to plant my own so I wouldn't have to hunt for them so hard. Hmm. What are your favorite types of, nut trees to grow?
Favorite place? well, right now there's, the Niagara Parks Commission has planted a lot of nut trees along their, parkway. I've, seen a lot of, nut trees locally here in Niagara Falls and St. Catharines. And Niagara on the Lake. A lot of the old farmsteads, still have, nut trees on the property.
So, so Ernie, I, I grow fruit trees, and I know I love them, they're wonderful, they can be fiddly and demanding. I understand that nut trees are easier to grow. Is that true? They're as easy as most ornamentals. they, Don't require a lot of attention. Some of them may require spraying. the more exotic types like the, English walnut, for instance, does require spraying when they're planted in larger numbers.
But single trees or, one or two trees on a property, usually, the cropping is not too bad. people can get a good crop of nuts off of them. almost every year. And our native trees, of course, you can plant all kinds of hickory and pecan and, walnuts and black walnuts, that is, and butternuts, hazelnuts.
there are, numerous kinds of nuts that, will fit into the landscape. It's funny, I don't know if you remember this, but many, many years ago, when I was starting a community orchard in my local park, I called you up, and I said I would love to integrate nut trees into our urban orchard. And I asked you for advice, and especially hickory nuts, I really wanted to plant hickory nuts.
I don't know if you remember what you said to me. One of my concerns about that is, We are importing all kinds of nuts from other countries that we could be growing ourselves. Hazelnuts, for instance, come in from Turkey and Europe and everywhere, and we could be growing our own. In fact, we do have a hazelnut association right now that is encouraging farmers to plant hazelnuts.
Ferrero Rocher is in Brantford, and they're interested in seeing hazelnuts produced in Ontario. And, there's the potential of 5 to 10, 000 acres of hazelnuts. they will take as much as we can produce.
[00:38:13] Nut Trees in Urban Environments
But what about growing them in an urban environment in the cities? The urban environment would be great.
and, you know, they look as nice as any ornamental that you plant. and they produce a nut crop. we do have, tools that will pick up the nuts very nicely. and you don't even have to stoop to pick them up. we have a, a tool called a wizard that, you roll on the ground, it looks like a football in shape, but it's made of wire, wires that, run longitudinally on the, unit, and you roll it on the ground and then nuts pop inside.
What about our main competitor here in the cities, and that's squirrels. Are they going to get it before, are they going to get the crop before we do? you've got to isolate your trees if you're going to grow them in the city. black walnuts are the last thing that the squirrels go after, but the English walnuts and the heartnuts and the hazelnuts, they fall prey mid summer.
So, some growers simply put a shield around the trunk of, Galvanized metal and, the squirrels can't climb up the trunk. So, as long as you isolate the tree from buildings, wires, and other access points, you can get the crop from the tree. Hmm. So that's good. So you can actually make them squirrel proof.
You can, to a degree. Hmm.
[00:39:56] Challenges and Solutions for Growing Nut Trees
Now, do most nut trees need full sun like fruit trees would need? I'm sorry. Do most nut trees need full sun, a lot of sunshine? Most of them do, yes. Mm hmm. So I, people can keep, consider that when they're considering planting nut trees. They should, yes. And, one of the nut trees that would be easiest to grow, likely would be chestnuts because a chestnut doesn't ripen until the very end of the season and, They have a spiny husk on the outside, and that does deter squirrels to a degree.
They'll still work their way through it, but, at least, that's a crop that can be grown in the city. We have in our orchard park, two shagbark hickory trees. They are very slow growing. Is that, is that pretty common with fruit trees? I mean, sorry, with nut trees. Not with most nut trees, and the grafted trees are a little faster, producing.
they can start producing in two or three years. Hazelnuts will produce even from, trees grown from seed in two or three years. The trees that take a long time are mainly the hickories and pecans. possibly black walnuts will take six to eight years. I've known, hickory trees to take 10 or 12 years, and I, I had one, hickory tree that took 20 years before it started to bear.
Oh, wow. that can happen, but, you know, if you don't plant them, you won't get anything. Mm. You're planting them for the next generation. Well, in some cases you are, in others, you're planting for your own needs. Mm. Yeah, and I suppose in the cities, people need to consider that, because they may be moving house in ten years, or, moving somewhere else, so you've planted for somebody else to enjoy your tree, not you.
That's true. Yeah. And, you know, if you want just a shade tree, why not plant a nut tree? it makes sense, even if you don't get the harvest. Hmm. It's true. Yeah. you know, it's, it's something that, People should consider. And if there's a time when, insurrection, loss of power, fuel shortages, or whatever may come along that causes a food shortage, you've got a potential crop.
Hmm. And the squirrels make a crop, too. Yeah, that's what I used to say. I thought, you know what? We'll plant nut trees, but first we have to start making squirrel stew. You know, I've even suggested to people to, feed them, something that will, Sterilize them temporarily, or at least, keep them from, reproducing.
Yeah, or give them milkshakes so they're not hungry. Yes. There's got to be a solution. Well, I guess in the city the reason we have problems with squirrels is they don't have any natural predators that come to dispose of them, to eat them. Well, that's true. And that's one of the problems with city situations.
Squirrels are almost to the point of being protected. And they're not afraid of people. In Niagara on the Lake, do you worry about squirrels at all, or is it just not a problem? they're allowed to come. They just aren't allowed to leave. Do you have your BB gun handy or something? Something like that, yeah.
I won't ask too many questions about that. The listeners don't need to know. I put out traps, and That takes care of most of my problems. Oh, wow. Amazing. it's funny because there was a project that I'm involved in and we're planting fruit trees on school grounds and I suggested planting nut trees and I was told it's not possible because there are a lot of children with nut allergies.
So no nut trees allowed. yeah. That can be a problem on school grounds. Hmm. Well, who are your main customers? Who are buying your trees? Who are? Yeah. well, a lot of, rural people. there are some city people, a lot of European, people from European descent. they know the, trees from their old country, and they want to reduplicate their environment here.
Hmm. And I guess also, being from those countries, they probably also know what hunger is about. Yes, you know, yes, especially the older generation. I don't know if you lived through any times of, of, you know, challenges with, with getting food. Did you and your, your family ever have those times where nuts were important?
I don't think so. No, it wasn't like you had to go out and get nuts to keep the family together and alive. That's right. We often get customers in who say that they They remember, when they were young and they were collecting, walnuts, and using them at Christmas time. they would collect the black walnuts, of course.
a lot of people don't know that black walnuts are edible. Hmm. And, they don't even know what to do with them if they ever, manage to collect them. They've got a hull on the outside that stains their hands, and so it's a real mess to handle. But, nut inside is well worth the flavor when you get to it.
That was Ernie Grimo of Grimo Nut Nursery. You're listening to the Urban Forestry Radio Show on Reality Radio 101.
[00:46:25] The Fruit Harvesting Project: Not Far From the Tree
Before we wrap up the show for today, I wanted to sneak in one more interview. There are so many ways that trees can help us deal with world hunger. We heard about the Arbor Day Foundation's Shade Grown Coffee program that supports coffee growers while protecting the environment.
We heard Ernie Grimo's encouraging words about growing nut trees, and they aren't, actually aren't as hard to grow as you may think. But, once you buy your shade grown coffee and plant your nut tree, what else can you do? Well, You can harvest somebody else's fruit tree and donate the bounty to those who need it most.
That's why I'm here in the Cedarvale neighborhood in Toronto, talking with Sue Arndt of Toronto's Fruit Harvesting Project Not Far From the Tree. Sue, thanks for meeting me on this chilly day in February. You're welcome. How are you today? Great, happy to be here. So tell me a little bit, here we are in Toronto, tell me where we're standing.
We are standing under a very beautiful cherry tree. And, and how does your organization work with trees like this? Not Far From The Tree has been working in Toronto since 2008 to help homeowners. who can't keep up with the harvest from their tree, harvest their tree and help donate the fruit to those that need it most through partnerships with social service agencies in the city.
Once you harvest the tree, you give it away. As you said, what kind of social service agencies who will get this fruit and enjoy it? we work with about 30 to 35 different partner agencies in the 14 city wards where we're working. They're incredibly diverse in the populations that they serve. From youth shelters to, social service agencies helping out, settling refugees, to women's shelters, to food banks and other food programs such as the stop and food share in the city.
So is it handed out as well? fresh fruit, bowls of apples and cherries, or is it used to make different products? What we do actually is coming from the pick itself. We take a third of the fruit harvested and it's delivered directly right after the pick to a local social social service agency in that neighborhood.
So it is donated as fresh fruit basically right off the tree. Okay, so there must be logistics involved. How does it all happen here? We've got a beautiful tree. How does it happen that it gets harvested and the fruit goes to those who need it most? There are a lot of logistics. We currently have about 2, 200 trees registered with our program all throughout the City of Toronto and we are currently only servicing about 1, 600 of those trees in our operating area.
We do most of our work through an amazing fleet of volunteers. We have over a thousand volunteers who work with us annually. from the fruit pickers to people that we train, to engage more deeply with, the actual leadership of the picks themselves. So they pick up the equipment, they show up to the pick, they're trained in safety, and in how to pick a tree, and how to recognize if the fruit's ripe, and then they lead the Pickers in that pick they we leave a third of the fruit with the homeowner if they want it.
Sometimes people Want to donate all the fruit so more goes to the agency is in that case and then those Leader volunteers who we actually call supreme gleaners They take a third of the fruit and then bring it to a agency in the neighborhood So we really rely heavily on these incredible individuals who give us so much of their time To help us run our program So if this was a beautiful summer day Which it is not, what would we see here?
We've got one big cherry tree. How many volunteers would we see? Would they be climbing all over it? We usually have one supreme cleaner and three to four volunteers per tree. So we try not to overrun the people's backyards that are giving us great access to their trees. If there's more trees, sometimes we pick up to six trees in a yard.
And six trees, we actually classify that as an orchard in the City of Toronto. we will have more volunteers. But basically, you know, we're looking at about four to five people that show up to a pick. we ask our homeowners if they can provide a ladder. We don't bring our own ladders. They're really hard logistics.
to get around because we do most of our work by cargo bike. so we, our supreme gleaners have been trained in, you know, how to run a safe pick. So we're doing most of the work by ladder. We do let our homeowners know that, you know, a tree that's over two stories, we probably won't be able to get to the very top of it, because we aren't climbing the tree, and we're trying not to, encourage unsafe practices in that realm.
So, Toronto is a big, busy city. What kind of fruit are we going to find growing in this amazing urban environment? There is so much fruit. It's amazing. So we start in cherry season, in the spring. sweet and sour cherries and mulberries and service berries and then we go to apricots and plums and pears and apples and crab apples really end out the season in the fall.
So in the middle of that, we also sometimes get, you know, more unique fruits that aren't seen as often like quince and pawpaw and, and things like that and ginkgo. So we have a lot of diversity and what's available in the city and and what draws the volunteers. What's in it for the volunteers to come and help you?
So I mean, the great part of a model is it is a fruit sharing program. So a third of the fruit does go to the social service agencies who partner with us for their communities and their clients. A third of it goes to the homeowner if they want it. And a third actually gets split up amongst the volunteers that are there that day picking.
So a lot of our volunteers come out because they're also Increasing their own access to this fresh food source. That's very local in the show today we're talking about how trees can help alleviate world hunger and Major problems like that. Can you really pick enough fruit to make a difference? How much fruit for instance last year?
Where you did you pick how much of a difference did it make? You know, I think you really can make a difference last year in 2015 We were able to pick 37, 000 pounds of fruit and share that amongst all of our participants. we estimate, using kind of a bit of an estimate and extrapolation of where we're picking, that there's at least a million pounds of fruit that is growing in the City of Toronto.
So what we're reaching is really just a drop in the bucket of what could be available and what could be picked and shared and used to help, people that need this. food. Now, I know when no
Has it grown in Canada and the United States? These, the idea of fruit picking programs, it definitely has grown. when we started in 2008, there was a few organizations that were doing work like this, two to three that we're aware of, that were mostly concentrated out in British Columbia, and now there's about 23 to 25 different organizations.
that are mostly, city based that are doing this work in neighbourhoods across Canada. So, and we, you know, we talk to each other and we try to support each other and, and it's a really great growing, project. Amazing.
[00:53:45] How to Start a Fruit Picking Project
Now, if a listener is listening to this program and thinking, well, I would like to start something like this near me, What's involved in starting a fruit picking project in your local community?
Well, you know, we're working at a pretty big scale but there's a great way to just get started in your own backyard or your neighbor's backyard or on your street by getting a few people together and deciding that they're gonna pick a tree and figure out how to get the fruit to some people in the neighborhood.
There's social service agencies all over the city that are looking for fresh food. so I would just recommend talking to some people in your neighborhood and seeing if they would be willing to take it. not far from the tree started in, you know, one small neighborhood with a few volunteers that just saw this opportunity and, you know, people are overwhelmed sometimes by the harvest off their own individual tree because it can be a lot.
Sometimes we can pick 500 pounds of apples off one tree. So, you know, that's overwhelming for a person. And if they feel like there's a few people in the neighborhood that would be willing to take some of that fruit, it's a great way to get people together. Very inspiring. It makes it feel like it's possible and it's doable that we can all make a difference.
With these small things, you start small, it's like the butterfly effect. Absolutely. And it radiates outwards. Definitely. Okay, well thank you so much for coming on the show today. So it's really nice to have you and to see one of these beautiful trees that you are harvesting or will be harvesting. And are you looking forward to the season to come?
We can't wait. Is there a lot of work to do before you get started? There is a lot of work to do between now and the cherries coming out. So you know, we're getting busy in our planning for 2016. Okay. Well, we wish you good luck and hopefully you'll come back on the show again. Great. Thank you for having me.
[00:55:32] Conclusion and Final Thoughts
That's all we have time for in today's show. If you missed any of our previous shows, you can listen to them online at www. orchardpeople. com slash network. You can also sign up for our iTunes feed and listen to our show on your mobile device. Do tune in again next month when we'll have a new lineup of guests talking to us about fruit trees, food forests, permaculture, and more.
Bye for now.
If you want to learn more about the Community Orchard Network, I've created a page on my website where you can find out lots more information and learn how to sign up for our newsletter. Just visit www. orchardpeople. com slash network and you can read our frequently asked questions. And check out the free webinars and podcasts that we've recorded.
Tune in next month and you'll meet some more great guests, and you'll learn more about fruit trees, permaculture, and forest gardens. Our show goes out on the last Tuesday of every month at 1 p. m. Eastern Time. I'm Susan Poizner. Thanks for tuning in, and I'll see you next time.
You've been listening to the Urban Forestry Radio Show, right here with Susan Poizner. On Reality Radio 101.
Are you new to growing fruit trees or perhaps a seasoned expert? Either way, come and join the Community Orchard Network. We are a group of community and home orchardists. From across North America who gather through monthly webinars, radio broadcasts like this one and podcasts, we want to share our experience, deepen our knowledge, and widen the movement.
Join the conversation. Visit www.orchardpeople.com/network to find out more. This message was brought to you by the Baltimore Orchard Project.
Enjoying the cool breeze under the shade of a tree, picking apples and berries from your local community orchard. Jumping in a pile of leaves. You can do all these activities and more. When you connect with nature where you live, Lily Leaf Solutions works to connect people with quality parks, trails, trees, and orchards near them.
Through technical expertise and data driven strategic planning, Lily Leaf Solutions empowers you. Urban residents to become advocates for nature in their communities. When we all have access to quality nature, we all progress together. Lilyleaf Solutions empowerment together. Follow us on Twitter at Lilyleaf and visit us at Lilyleaf.com today.